Spring Harvest children's worship songs

[jim bailey]

Having done some vocals on Spring Harvest pre-school worship cd, i got to thinking how many children's worship songs are written that are used by others especially from SH children's worship albums. the quality of the songs on the Sh pre-school album range from quality crafted well thought thru songs to lowest common denominator. I kind of cringe inside when people rush up to me with a new song they have just written in 10 minutes. It takes me about about a year to craft, wait and work on a song, and its not uncommon to have 9 to 10 re-writes of pieces of the song. I suppose there are original well crafted songs that stand the test of time, then there are 'ikea print' songs. what is your favourite children's worship song ?, and why ?. how much is it personal taste that filters your song selections and how much is it functionability !

[Steve Morgan-Gurr]

Isaac Watts wrote a lot of hymns for children 'Divine and moral songs'. His preface to this says much of what I believe we should be looking at - rhyme and rhythm to help worthwhile topics stick in the mind. A couple of questions for further thought - should there be a difference between songs to be performed and listened to, and those intended for children to join in? Should 'Christian' music be distinctive from other types or exactly the same apart from the words? I'm not advocating a return to socks & sandals and singing Kumbaya, but it's worth reviewing constantly what we are doing.

[Mike Harrowing]

"lowest common denominator" - yeah Jim, why is it that the in house Spring compilations always contain incredibly naff versions of the originals?!

"cringe inside when people rush up to me with a new song they have just written in 10 minutes" - couple of years ago at springy Ishmael was talking in Omega Zone (Dave Godfreys 8-11's group) and said something along the lines of "I believe that if a song isn't written within 3minutes then it's not from God, i write most of my songs within 3 minutes in the shower!". and i thought to myself, yup, you can tell... they really do make in cringe [disclaimer: i'm not a Ishmeal hater, i have a lot of respect for him... just not most of his songs...]

"what is your favourite children's worship song ?, and why ?" - i am a massive fan of Dave Godfrey's songs, they aren't all perfect, some are rubbish, but they are mostly catchy and fun. they also have a wide appeal. i do alot of schools work and his songs can be easily sung by unchurch/nonchristian children. i use a lot of Doug horley too, though not his rave stuff! ...and i'm trying to find a excuse to use fearfully and wonderfully designed... ;-)

"personal taste" - i wince everytime i have to do our God is a great big God, i think i still be singing it in my grave... but the children still love it

[Steve Morgan-Gurr]

Albums from Dave Godfrey, Jim B, Doug and the Big God stuff are not achieved cheaply. Part of the issue is that kids albums do not sell as many as adult ones, and usually a large proportion of the production cost is required these days from the writer. So unless you have a few £000 to invest, the production will not be as good as those you have rated highly, all of which have good songs and good production. I actually look at production as a separate issue :- that can be improved by spending out on good musicians & technicians!
The quality of songs is another matter, and we do need to be aware of the target audience. Many of Ish's are designed for and brilliant for under 5's who enjoy them and remember Bible truths as a result, even if they can't read. Fantastic!
8 years plus would of course require a different presentation of the same truths.
The first thing to get right is the word content - catchy tunes / musical style & presentation / production & fun can (and probably should) all be added but the core needs to be there. Many kids - and indeed adults - learn their theology from songs and we have a serious responsibility to get it right!

[Nigel Hemming]

Interesting stuff guys.... I'm with Jim on the whole 'crafting a song' thing... My observation is that a song written in 10 minutes can be enjoyed for a while and may prove useful in a specific context but will generally not stand the test of time as another song will come along which says the same thing better! I'm with Steve on the huge distinction between writing and production.

One of the issues I see is that there are lots of people who are out there doing songs as part of the kids ministry they are involved in but not many of their songs are recorded because they don't necessarily posses the musical skills necessary. On the other hand, often the albums put out by record companies in response to the 'marketplace' are played & sung by session musicians who don't have much (if any) kids worship authenticity (Jim - you doing the vocals for SH is an exception to this!). There don't seem to be that many people who posess both the musical/production skills necessary to make a decent album AND the kids worship credentials to make it genuinely authentic hence we get lots of albums that either sound a bit cheap & naff or sound totally plastic & stale... If we could just find some more middle ground....

Now I've had my 'rant' I'll answer your first question Jim. Since I started leading kids worship 14 years ago there are a few songs I still keep coming back to - Holy Spirit Pour Your Power, Jesus I need you deep down in my heart, As for me & my House, We Wanna See Jesus Lifted High - to name but four. For me its mainly about functionality - these are well written songs which just work in many contexts. Some of the more recent songs I may choose may have more of an element of personal taste in them but accessibilty is never too far away from my reasoning. We've just started doing "I'm Gonna Jump Up & Down" by Doug cos it's really good fun, it's very well written & we needed a new clapping/jumping song having pretty much exhausted 'I'm Gonna Clap My Hands' from the GBG album - and like I always say - you do need a new 'clapping, jumping & dancing' song every couple of years!

[Ellie Wartew]

I love the GBG CDs and use them in lots of different settings where we need sung worship.
I don't think it matters how long it has taken to write a song so long as it has been produced with care.
I studied the Theology, Music and Worship course at LST before getting into full-time children's work and I am as 'picky' about the theological content of children's worship as I am when planning for adult services. All the song choices should contribute to a coherent worship journey that enables the children to step into the throne room of God and glorify their Maker.
Our children deserve to participate in times of sung worship that speak the truth about who God is and what he has done and that provide them with a good vocabulary with which to express their love for him and reverence for his Holiness.
As we all know we must use appropriate language without dumbing down. A lot of the time an adult worship song reproduced with a funky musical arrangement can function just as well in a kids worship context as a song written specifically with children in mind (and of course, vice-versa - Doug Horley's Glory and Honour has become a favourite with our adult congregation since the kids taught it to them).
The melody must be easy to learn and remember (and to recreate if you don't have an incredible house band) but more importantly, as children's songwriters, we are putting words of worship into the mouths of children all over the country, perhaps for those very successful people, the world - let's make sure they are good ones!

[Graeme]

I have to start by saying that I have never and don't expect to ever write a song, but over the last 15+ years using music I have noticed that certain artists obviously have different strengths and weaknesses in terms of the usability of their music.

For example if I want to lead worship in my kids church setting then I'll lean towards Hillsongs DVD's, particularly the last couple, if I want music to use in a setting with kids from outside the church I'll go for some of Doug Horleys latest albums as he tends to capture the musical style of the moment pretty well (funky sheep!) or for similar reasons some of new wines newer cd's. But one issue that has forever bugged me is the words!

Words in children's songs often render the best sounding song unusable with an non-christian audience. When I ran a kids club in a local run down community I used a lot of Doug's music, but I did some careful digital re-editing to select just the verse/s that would be truthful for children to sing. A non-christian child can sing about the amazing things God has done (statements about God's greatness!), but should the songs also lead the kids make professions of faith that aren't true?

I'm not advocating the wholesale abolition of worship songs in kids ministry, but maybe we should keep songs that express worship in the context where there is a reasonable expectation that the children will and do mean what they sing? Or do I sound too picky???

Very quickly I do have to confess to loving the songs that overlap the hills kids, youth and adults departments, what genius for making all age services accessible to all!

[Nigel Hemming]

I totally agree about the song words - we need different types of songs - some which declare truth in a relevant and funky way, some which help to learn / memorize the bible and others which help kids connect directly with God. A kids song seems to have loads more contexts than an adult one It's fascinating to hear in this discussion about all the different places kids songs get used i.e. kids church, family service, home, school, clubs etc. I love writing songs for church but I get really excited when I hear about songs which have found their way into peoples lives through other routes...

[Graeme]

I guess a possible reason that kids songs have more contexts than adult songs is that children are generally expected to join in if they are in that venue (church, club, school, family service, etc). Where as we might expect adults to have the capacity to decide if they agree with the words and choose to sing them? Or maybe singing is culturally limited for adults to churches, football / rugby stadiums and pubs? At which point the type of song and the expectation of that song is clearly defined before adults attend...

[Sian Gasson]

Jim, I tend to agree with what you say about the quality of children's songs. I have not written many, but when I do, they take a while to "craft" (write, re-write, get annoyed with etc...). However, I use a lot of CDs in Kids' Church, assemblies, clubs, services, and I find about 3 or 4 on each CD that I would use. There seem to be more fillers than inspired songs. Maybe I'm being a bit harsh, but songs that work in your own church don't always work everywhere. Our Kids' Church (5-10s) voted last summer and their favourite was, by far, "One Way", followed by (in no particular order): God's Love is Big, Let Your Light Shine, Jesus is my Superhero, Jesus is the Rock, May the God of Hope, Jesus Reign in Me, All I Know...
Some of these transfer well into an All Age setting, and are easy for the worship group to learn, some don't, so we use a few in All Age, and also songs like How Great is our God, Give Thanks to the Lord, Lord I Lift Your Name, My Jesus My Saviour, Every Day, Every Move I Make...
This area is a passion of mine, so I'm always happy to give feedback!

[Reuben]

Just joined the group - really interesting discussion. I mainly work with pre-school aged children in a church setting. Controversially I'm not convinced that it is the quality of the original song that matters so much as how it's used. None of us are very musical but we freely adapt songs (changing words, using tunes from TV or nursery rhymes, taking the chorus out of adult songs etc). It's done in a very interactive playful way adding bits of the weeks bible story, children's pets or whatever into the song. For children under six simple words, familiar or easy tunes, lots of moving around and a sense of fun seem enough - even if the song is really ancient or corny. I've seen a similar approach used even in big concerts (Fischy music in Scotland does it brilliantly both at church events and in schools). I also went to the Springharvest Skegness family worship things - and they also used a range of often ancient children's songs very effectively - but it was there mix of songs games media and talks (all done in a playful but reverent way) that was so engaging.

[Steve Morgan-Gurr]

This is a plea for those who are 'musical' to get involved with songs etc for all ages! If we are all made in the image of God, why should we tolerate the fact that those with most musical talent gravitate to the adults and avoid the under 5's? Good theology, good fun, a knowledge of developmental ages and stages are needed as well as some musical and poetic nowse.
Take a look at spring harvest Pre School Praise and see if you can do better. Issue a challenge to your church worship leader to get involved in this valuable investment in the present for the future.
Please don't think that it's OK to compromise quality because of the age of the kids!!! Only the best will do.

[Graeme]

A lot of this comes down to the ages, the type of group of kids you have and the expectations they have. If your church sings hymns, then quite possibly anything remotely funny would grab attention. I face an opposite challenge as our main church services are as full on as you might possibly imagine (lights, sound, smoke, huge 8m video screen, etc) and therefore our kids expect similar and the only way to deliver that is by using mpegs (from Hillsongs Kids) which provide both up-to-date musical style and also link into the main church set lists. However I face the difficulty of then interpreting this into the world of u5's...